TOWN
OF
PLANNING BOARD
DRAFT MINUTES
June 28, 2017
Chairman
Ian Murray called the meeting to order at 7:00 p.m.
Planning Clerk Linda McCabe called the roll: Chairman Ian Murray – present, Laurie
Griffen – present, Patrick Hanehan – present, Robert McConnell – present, Joseph
Lewandowski – present, Brandon Myers – present,
George Olsen - present,
Alternate Christopher Koval
- absent.
Also
attending: Mary Maranville,
Cliff Silverstein, Jim Vianna, Jarrad
Garone, Stephen Poulin, Garry
Robinson, Frank Owens, Edith Rubinson, Terri Korb, Dan Wheeler, Roy Lerman,
Paul Murphy. (Sign-in sheet is on file
in the Clerk's office)
Approved
Minor Subdivision Sketch Plan
Cliff Silverstein #17-15 Owner: Kevin J. Johnson
346 Pyramid Pines Rd. 1107 Rt. 9P
Saratoga, NY 12866 Saratoga Springs, NY 12866
S/B/L 193.14-1-23 Lake
Residential
Location: 1268 Rt. 9P
Applicant
seeks to subdivide his parcel into a two lot subdivision; the property is .85
acre and has 175' of frontage.
Applicant
Cliff Silverstein appeared before the Board and reviewed the proposed two lot
subdivision.
Chairman
Ian Murray questioned how they came up with the 175' of frontage, because he comes up with 132'.
The
Applicant stated that's what the realtor told them, that's what the county map
shows and that's what their surveyor said.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated they may have gone off the tax map, but a survey gives the
accurate measurement. This will work
even with 132'. He then questioned the
intention for the balance of the land across the road, if it will go with Lot 1
or Lot 2.
Applicant
Cliff Silverstein responded it will be divided up between them.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded the Applicant will need to show that on the survey map. He then stated we can advertise for a public
hearing for next month, as long as the Applicant provides the Board with the
updated map stamped by the surveyor, with the correct frontage on it as well as
the split of the parcel on the lakeside.
Applicant
Cliff Silverstein thanked the Board.
Returning
Hanehan Realty Assoc. LLC #17-18 Representative: James Vianna, PLS
340 Co. Rt. 68 170 Lohnes Rd.
Saratoga Springs, NY 12866 Stillwater, NY 12170
S/B/L 183.-1-39
Location: 228 Co. Rt. 69 (Coveville
Rd.)
Applicant
seeks to subdivide the 1.5 acre parcel from the 74.5 acre farm. The Applicant is aware that an area variance
is needed.
James
Vianna, PLS, appeared on behalf of the Applicant, reviewed
the application stating there will be no new construction, it meets all
setbacks aside from .5 acres, which he knows will have to go before the Zoning
Board of Appeals for a variance.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated that when he surveys that land to please identify the
location of the well and septic on the map and note that the balance of the
land will remain in agriculture until such time in the future, if they wish to
do something other than agriculture pursuits with the balance of the land, they
will have to appear before the Board.
Chairman
Ian Murray asked if there were any Board questions; there were none. He then questioned the Board if they wish to
send this to the ZBA for the variance and the Board said yes. Chairman Ian Murray stated the Applicant
needs to go before the ZBA for the frontage variance and if granted, come back
before this Board for a public hearing.
Jim
Vianna thanked the Board.
Special Use Permit Pre-Submission Conference
Stephen Poulin
#17-16
282 Hayes Rd.
Schuylerville, NY 12871
S/B/L 169.-1-39 Rural
Applicant
has an existing non-permitted apartment above his detached garage. He is now
selling his property and is seeking a special use permit in order to make it
compliant with the Town's regulations.
Applicant
Stephen Poulin appeared before the Board stating he
sold the property today.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated the Applicant had put a non-compliant, non-permitted
apartment above the garage and now wants to bring it into compliance.
The
Applicant replied yes.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated it is allowable with the new Town law, but the Applicant must
have a separate well and separate septic system for the apartment above the
garage.
The
Applicant responded that in the past the property had a couple of trailers on it
and the septic is tied to the old trailer septic. The new house has its own septic.
Laurie
Griffen questioned if they are operational.
The
Applicant responded yes and added that the water draws from the house for the
apartment, which they used for his mother-in-law; they never rented it out. The realtor is the one who marketed this as a
home with a rental property. He never
intended that.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated regardless of that, the property must come into compliance in
case the new owner wants to rent it out.
Although the Applicant didn't intend to rent it out, he did construct a
non-permitted, non-compliant apartment.
He then explained that in future there's the potential that the new
owner may want to subdivide it and it cannot be subdivided if the water and
septic are connected as is. This is why
it has to become compliant now.
Patrick
Hanehan stated the Applicant can take it down and
turn it back into just a garage.
The
Applicant responded no, the buyer wants the apartment.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated in order to become compliant the Board needs verification of
the septic system; there are distances that must be maintained between the well
and the septic, so the Board needs to know the location and it needs to be identified
on the map. He also stated it does need
another well, as the apartment cannot be tied to the house. He added that the well can go on the property
line but the septic can't be more than 10' from the road.
The
Applicant questioned what he's to do from here.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated the Applicant should check the well cap and on the inside of
it he'll see the well driller's name and also how deep the well is. He could contact that company to have them put
in the new well. He told him to be sure
the setbacks are met; he needs to maintain 100' separation distance from well
to septic on both. Chairman Ian Murray
then added that the Applicant will also need to contact the surveyor and have
the surveyor locate and identify the well and septic systems on the map, so the
Board knows where they are and that will dictate where the new well can be
placed; then have the new well's location identified on the map also. He could possibly use the existing for the
garage - terminate it from the house and then put the new one in for the house.
The
Applicant questioned if this needs to be done between now and the next meeting
in order for a public hearing.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded yes.
Returning
Frank Owens #17-17 Representative: Garry Robinson, P.E.
62 Louden
Rd.
Saratoga Springs, NY 12866
S/B/L 157.-1-29 Rural
Residential
Location: 1167 Rt. 29
Returning
Applicant seeks a special use permit to open a restaurant concession business
at 1167 Rt. 29. The 1.12 acre parcel has
413 feet of frontage.
Garry
Robinson appeared on behalf of the Applicant, stating the parcel is 1.6 acres
and that the Applicant would like a restaurant/concession stand. It will be approximately an 8.5' x 30' long
trailer and he will be selling hot dogs, burgers etcetera. He also wants to construct a pole barn with
picnic tables as well as bathroom facilities on this parcel, adding he designed
the septic system. He passed out photos
depicting the type of trailer and pole barn he plans to use. He stated he knows they need variances and will
have to go to the Zoning Board of Appeals.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated that is absolutely correct; the parcel doesn't meet
regulations. He questioned if this is to
be a seasonal restaurant.
Garry
Robinson said yes, three seasons.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated he will need approval from NYSDOH (New York State Department
of Health) and a NYSDOH permit is required for potable water.
Chairman
Ian Murray then stated there is no location of septic shown; it needs to be on
the map; need to be sure they meet setbacks.
Garry
Robinson said he tested where the leach field should be.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded there's serious compaction in the soil or high ground
pocket of water by the well. On the
second test hole you encountered water at 2"; he doesn't think they can
meet requirements. Chairman Ian Murray
then stated on the north-west corner, where the fill was put in, the Applicant
needs to have that area investigated.
ACOE (Army Corp of Engineer) wetlands are probably there and that will
require a permit. In regards to SWPPP
(storm water pollution prevention plan), when sent to NYSDOT, be sure to look
at ingress/egress; a curb cut permit through NYSDOT is needed, but unsure if it
is obtainable.
Chairman
Ian Murray asked if there were any Board questions.
Robert
McConnell questioned if the ZBA will give a 50% variance.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded the Applicant should consider merging the parcels to help.
Merging
would make it better - 50% is a very large variance. Chairman Ian Murray stated he feels it is
excessive for the lot size.
Robert
McConnell stated as it's a different use, it's iffy.
Approved
Public Hearing Special Use Permit
Jarrad Garone #17-12
832 Knickerbocker
Rd.
Schaghticoke, NY 12154
S/B/L 183.-1-19
Location: 886 Rt. 4 South
Returning
Applicant seeks a special use permit to open a bar, restaurant, gas pump
station for boats and ice-cream stand.
The name will be The Cove on the Hudson and the property is the old
Alcove bar & restaurant.
Jarrad Garone appeared before
the Board.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated that new information was brought in and the merging of the
two parcels for this application occurred today; the Board was provided copies
of the updated deed reflecting the merger.
He then asked the Applicant if he understood why the Board had to have
this before going forward and the Applicant responded yes.
Chairman
Ian Murray questioned what further investigation the Applicant has done
concerning the septic location and parking, as the Board requested this the
last time he was before them.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone responded
there's been no further investigation, he's putting in a new system.
Chairman
Ian Murray asked where is it going and the Applicant replied in the existing
location.
Laurie
Griffen stated the current system could be where
everyone parks. She then asked when the
boats will be moved, as he previously told the Board the boats would all be
moved.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone responded the
owner has until the 30th to move them and if he doesn't, he will move them himself.
Chairman
Ian Murray questioned what the hours of operation will be.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone replied 11
a.m. - 11 p.m.
Chairman
Ian Murray questioned if there will be outside entertainment and if it will be
year round.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone replied yes,
and since it will be mostly outdoors it will end at 11 p.m.
He
said he's probably going to go down to 5 days weekly in the winter and hours
will be 4 p.m. - 10 p.m.
Laurie
Griffen questioned the fuel tank location.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone responded it
will not be moved from its current place.
Laurie
Griffen then stated that the NYSDOH (New York State
Department of Health) certificate is for 55 people until the new septic is
in. She then noted that the address on
the NYSDOH certificate is incorrect and he needs to have that corrected. It should read Town of Saratoga, not Village
of Schuylerville.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone stated he'd
like to open Saturday, but has to order food etcetera.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded if approved, the boats must be moved before the Board can
let him open. The owner was supposed to
move them, but only 6 have been moved; they were all supposed to be gone by the
30th, which is in two days.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone responded
that Zoning Officer/Building Inspector Gil Albert is going out there tomorrow
to go over the parking spaces.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated the Applicant needs to have Jim Vianna,
PLS, chart out the parking on the map and the location of the septic.
Laurie
Griffen stated there needs to be separate parking for
the restaurant also.
Chairman
Ian Murray reminded the Applicant that he told him to get the septic
investigated and on the map. He also
reminded him the Board needs to know where the leach field is as it could be
where everyone parks and you cannot have that.
He also added that Town Engineer Ken Martin and Zoning Officer/Building
Inspector Gil Albert need to approve it also.
Laurie
Griffen and Patrick Hanehan
suggested he put in Port-A-Potty's and they can set a deadline date when the
new system must be in and operating.
Laurie Griffen suggested a 2 month time
period.
George
Olsesn questioned if this has to receive a
Certificate of Occupancy (CO) from Zoning Officer/Building Inspector Gil
Albert. If so, bathrooms will be needed.
Brandon
Myers questioned why parking isn't on the site plan. Chairman Ian Murray stated this is the
survey.
Laurie
Griffen stated the Board needs a site plan with
parking, signage, etcetera. She told the
Applicant he's getting there, but just not quite there yet. The Board has to make sure everything goes
forward and not backward.
Robert
McConnell stated he believes the Board is taking chances rushing this and
Chairman Ian Murray agreed.
George
Olsen would like to see parking as he has concerns with the location of the
septic.
Robert
McConnell said they could make it conditional; he'd be comfortable once the
septic is identified.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated they'd need final review of the deed by Town Attorney William
Reynolds, Sanitary Design and Installation by a professional, Town Engineer Ken
Martin's review, Inspection by Zoning Officer/Building Inspector Gil Albert,
Maximum occupancy of 55, removal of the boats, parking plan, boat parking plan,
restaurant parking plan, as well as signage and lighting.
Laurie
Griffen reiterated the boats need to go.
Patrick
Hanehan said he thinks the Applicant should come back
once everything is done; there's be too many conditions.
Brandon
Myers said he'll be lucky to get all that done in a month; it's a big list of
needs.
Applicant
Jarrad Garone said if he
finds the septic then he can go forward.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated he's not if favor of that.
The Board doesn't know what is under there, and they cannot approve
anything substandard. Not knowing it's location for certain is a liability to the Town if
they approve.
Joseph
Lewandowski doesn't want the Applicant to lose the season; they could have
Zoning Officer/Building Inspector Gil Albert and Town Engineer Ken Martin
inspect the septic, parking, safety reviews.
Laurie
Griffen stated they could vote for contingencies but
feels it's unrealistic for a 2 week turnaround.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated we did advertise for a public hearing for tonight.
Proof of
Notice having been furnished by newspaper on June 18, 2017, Chairman Ian Murray
opened the Public Hearing at 8:38 p.m., asking those wishing to speak to please stand and state their name and
address; seeing as no one spoke, Chairman
Ian Murray closed the Public Hearing at 7:39 p.m.
Laurie Griffen read the
short form EAF, line by line, which was completed by the Board.
v Consolidation
deed reviewed and approved by Bill Reynolds
v Sanitary system
designed, approved and installed
v Review and sign
off by Ken Martin
v Hours of
operation 11 a.m.-11 p.m. Entertainment
ending by 8 p.m.
v Maximum
occupation set at 55 per DOH
v 35 parking
spaces provided
v Site plan
showing parking for above and boat/trailer parking
v All boats
removed
v Signage and
lighting
Chairman Ian Murray – nay, Laurie Griffen – aye, Patrick Hanehan – nay,
Joseph Lewandowski – aye, Robert McConnell – aye, Brandon Myers – nay, George
Olsen - aye, Christopher Koval - absent. Carried 4 - 3
Approved with
Conditions
Laurie Griffen made a motion, seconded by Joseph Lewandowski, to
amend the conditional approval by also placing a 6 month review/renewal on it. Chairman Ian Murray – aye,
Laurie Griffen – aye, Patrick Hanehan
– aye, Joseph Lewandowski – aye, Robert McConnell – aye, Brandon Myers – aye,
George Olsen - aye, Christopher Koval - absent.
Carried 7 - 0 for the 6 month review/renewal.
To clarify, prior
to the issuance of the Special Use Permit, the Applicant must complete the
following:
1.
Consolidation deed reviewed and approved by Bill Reynolds
2.
Sanitary system designed, approved and installed
3.
Review and sign off by Ken Martin
4.
Hours of operation 11am-11pm. Entertainment ending by 8pm
5.
Maximum occupation set at 55 per DOH
6.
35 parking spaces provided
7.
Site plan showing parking for above and boat/trailer parking
8.
All boats removed
9.
Signage and lighting
10.
6 month renewable permit
Special Use Permit Amendment
Mary T. Maranville
and Kevin A. Dott #17-14
257 N. Alvarado Ave.
Ojai, CA 93023
S/B/L 155.-1-63.2 Rural
Residential
Location: 727 Rt. 29
Applicant
wishes to amend her Special Use Permit by adding more parking spaces.
Applicant
Mary Maranville and Ken Dott
appeared before the Board and stated she purchased a portion of Whooley Rd. which now gives her a total of 6 acres.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated the Applicant wants an amendment but gave the Board no
details for spaces.
Applicant
Mary Maranville stated she wants to double the
parking to 80 spaces.
Laurie
Griffen questioned where they would be located. The Applicant pointed out on the map where
she wants them to go.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated, as they told the previous Applicant, the Board needs to see
how they are placing them on the map. He
added they also need to identify the new septic system on the map.
Applicant
Mary Maranville stated they are putting it in a
different area. They did the perc test and Gil Albert said it is much better in the new
location; they're replacing the existing tank and going across with a pump
system to eliminate the old system.
They'll re-grade the old roadway to get extra parking also.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated they'd rather see gravel instead of blacktop.
Applicant
Mary Maranville stated they don't think there will be
too much traffic due to clients using hotels and bussing everyone in. The extra parking will be used for overflow
parking and they will be keeping it as green as possible.
Chairman
Ian Murray questioned who is doing the septic engineering and the Applicant
replied Rich Nolan.
Chairman
Ian Murray said they can't fill in the storm water retention basin. The Applicant needs to have their engineer
get in touch with the LA Group to see what they did for the previous owner and ask
for location of the retention basin. He
added they also need to have their engineer do the parking layout and site
plan.
Laurie
Griffen stated the scope of the parking has changed;
she questioned if the business is
changing too.
Applicant
Mary Maranville replied her priority is to keep
guests safe and the shuttle system will be good and Uber
is coming so most folks would want to use them as well as the shuttle system.
Laurie
Griffen questioned if the scope of client base has changed.
This is supposed to be education based.
Applicant
Mary Maranville responded she can't afford to do that
now.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated then the scope has changed.
Applicant
Mary Maranville stated occupancy is 227 which is why
she bought the extra road area for parking.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded and also for code compliancy. The Board needs to know if the scope of the
business has changed. The Board needs to
see the parking. We have to make certain
this is done correctly now. The
Applicant could win the lottery tomorrow; it is not up to the next owner to
make things right.
Laurie
Griffen questioned what the Applicant's intentions
are. The special use permit was approved
based upon the education business. We
need a better narrative on what you plan to do there.
Ken
Dott stated the plan is to have as many weddings
there as possible.
Laurie
Griffen stated the special use permit was for the
education business with some weddings to supplement that business. Is the intent to also use this as a bed &
breakfast? The Applicant's having people
stay there overnight to prep for the weddings.
Applicant
Mary Maranville replied no, this will be her second
residence.
Laurie
Griffen responded the Applicant said people will be
staying overnight.
Applicant
Mary Maranville responded yes, but she only wants
this as farm to table events.
Laurie
Griffen stated the scope has changed and the Board
needs a clear narrative.
Applicant
Mary Maranville said she still wants to do what she
originally said.
Laurie
Griffen responded that the Applicant stated this will
be her second residence. She questioned
if this is to be her home.
Applicant
Mary Maranville replied yes, once she sells her house
in CA. She then said things have
changed; this has cost her a lot of money in refurbishing.
Laurie
Griffen responded this has changed from what was
presented originally to this Board.
Applicant
Mary Maranville complained about all the regulations
she needs to comply with for the building.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated he won't comment since that is Zoning Officer/Building
Inspector Gil Albert's purview.
Ken
Dott complained that they're trying to do things
right, but Gil Albert keeps changing his mind on what they need to do.
George
Olsen stated building codes have changed over the past few months.
Chairman
Ian Murray added they can't push that on the Planning Board. This Board does not do code issues.
Ken
Dott reiterated that the Board needs drawings showing
parking and they can use the previous owners parking.
Chairman
Ian Murray responded correct, as well as a narrative.
Ken
Dott replied he doesn't know how many times a year
they'll do weddings.
Chairman
Ian Murray and Brandon Myers stated Zoning Officer/Building Inspector Gil
Albert is not going to design it for them; the narrative is needed.
Ken
Dott responded three weeks ago they were told they
need a state inspection, on Monday they were told they didn't; which is
it? Gil keeps giving different stories;
they want a punch list from him. He said
they absolutely need sprinklers, now he says they don't. They're trying to follow his guidelines but
they keep changing.
Chairman
Ian Murray stated this Board doesn't change its mind, when the Board states it
needs something from an applicant, it needs what was requested.
Returning
Information:
Dan
Wheeler spoke with the Board concerning a lot-line adjustment on Cramer
Rd. After discussing the parcel Chairman
Ian Murray stated a lot-line adjustment can be done.
Old Business: none
New Business: none
Meeting
Adjourned
The
next regular meeting will be held Wednesday, July 26, 2017 at
Respectfully
submitted,
Linda
A. McCabe
Planning
Clerk