TOWN OF SARATOGA
PLANNING BOARD
MINUTES -
DRAFT
February 28,
2007 - 7:30 PM
Chairman
Ian Murray called the meeting to order at 7:32 p.m.
Planning
Clerk Catherine Cicero called the roll.
Chairman Ian Murray – present, Ralph Pascucci – absent (Mr. Pascucci
arrived at 7: 37 p.m.), Paul Griffen – absent, Robert Park – present, Laurie
Griffen – present, Patrick Hanehan – present, Robert McConnell – absent, and
Alternate Jennifer Koval – present.
Approval of Minutes: All
Board members present had read the minutes of the January 24, 2007 meeting. A motion was made by Laurie Griffen,
seconded by Patrick Hanehan, to accept the minutes of January 24, 2007 as
written. Chairman Ian Murray – aye, Robert Park – aye, Patrick Hanehan –
aye, Ralph Pascucci – aye, and Laurie Griffen – aye. Carried 5 – 0.
Chairman Ian Murray made a
motion, seconded by Laurie Griffen, to elevate Alternate Jennifer Koval to
voting status due to the absence of Paul Griffen and Robert McConnell. Chairman Ian Murray – aye, Robert Park –
aye, Laurie Griffen – aye, Patrick Hanehan – aye, and Ralph Pascucci – aye.
Carried 5 – 0.
Order of Business:
Subdivisions
Willard F. Chamberlin Trust, Applicant
143 Circular Street
Saratoga Springs, NY
12866
S/B/L 155.-1-46.11,-46.2, and 46.3 Rural Residential
Returning Applicant proposes
a 28-lot conservation subdivision on 89.7 +/- acres on the north side of Route
29, across from Bryants Bridge Road, to be named Schuyler Hills.
Peter David, of the LA Group,
appeared on behalf of the Applicant and gave an update on the project since it
was last before the Board in December, 2005.
He gave a brief history, stating that the parcel was approved for a
35-lot conventional subdivision in 1990.
In March 2005, the Applicant proposed a 32-lot conservation
subdivision. The Board did a
walk-through of the property in the following month, and granted preliminary
approval for the project in December, 2005.
Mr. David stated that, although the application has not been before the
Board for several months, he has been in frequent contact with Chairman Ian
Murray and Town Engineer Kenneth Martin regarding the proposal.
Since then, the proposal has
been modified in several respects. The number of lots has been reduced to 28
due to required setbacks for wetlands and between wells and septic systems,
leaving 52.917+/- acres of open space.
The road has been shifted
150’ to the west, improving its relationship to Bryants Bridge Road and
avoiding an archaeologically sensitive area.
The grading has been changed, as well as the drainage system, which is
now an open system rather than the previously proposed closed system.
In accordance with a NYS DOH
recommendation, 4 test wells and 4 deep test pits were dug and the results were
approved.
NYS DOT, Town Engineer
Kenneth Martin, and Town Highway Superintendent David Hall have discussed the
road plans. The slope has been
minimized and erosion control blankets will be put down for re-vegetation. Mr. David offered a list of proposed trees
for replanting, adding that there will be more landscaping than in the initial
plan. He said the look will be less
barren than previously and the entrance will look nicer. He said that the Applicant is hoping for a
public hearing in April and would like final approval at that time.
Chairman Ian Murray had
several remarks:
The drawing cover sheet must
state that there will be no further subdivision on open-space land.
The final submission of the
maps must be stamped. Mr. David said
that storm water modifications would be made to the drawings and then the final
maps would be printed and stamped.
The SEQR review can’t be
completed until a letter is received from NYS DOH.
A Home Owners Association
must be established to maintain the open space areas. Mr. David said the attorney for the Applicant is handling the
contract for the Home Owners Association.
On drawing L-1, the driveway
for Lot 28 must come off of the subdivision.
Ralph Pascucci noted that, by moving the roadway over, a lot has been
removed that would have provided screening for the subdivision; the vegetation
will be gone that would have hidden everything. He said that although the planting of oaks and maples will
provide good screening 30 years from now, there will be no visual buffer for
years. Mr. Pascucci said that Lot 27 is
a major concern because the visual impact along Route 29 is what gives the
impression of the rural character of the Town to motorists passing
through.
A discussion followed on the
types of soil on the parcel, the use of larger trees for screening, and the use
of a landscape plan for the side slopes.
Ralph Pascucci requested that the Applicant make an inventory of the
existing trees so they can be identified and preserved. He said the clearing plan should be approved
by Town Engineer Kenneth Martin and strictly limited. Robert Park requested that the Applicant provide a sketch or
photos to show what the vegetation currently looks like. That information should include housing
elevations. Mr. David said that he would provide something at the next meeting
and added that the planned tree plantings will include a mix of evergreen and
deciduous. Mr. Pascucci asked whether
there would be a significant no-cut area.
Chairman Ian Murray said that
he would like to see the septic system on Lot 15 reconfigured to the back of
the house so the screening vegetation on that lot wouldn’t be affected. Mr. David raised concerns about separation
distances, saying they are currently very tight. Ralph Pascucci asked whether the septic systems could be situated
side-by-side; Mr. David responded that a lot of them are that way.
Chairman Ian Murray had
several questions regarding the grading notes on drawing L-1. He asked if the 1990 survey was upgraded
before being used as the base map. Mr.
David responded that the topo map is within “planning stages accurate” and that
the building contractors will be responsible for verifying all field
conditions. Chairman Ian Murray pointed
out that the SWPPP procedures are mandatory regarding erosion control, so the
map language should be stricken. He
also requested language to make erosion control mandatory on the slopes.
A brief discussion followed
on erosion control along the roadway.
Mr. David agreed to revise the maps.
The road radius will be 33’
according to Town Engineer Kenneth Martin and Town Highway Superintendent David
Hall. It was determined that a letter
from NYS DOT to that effect would not be necessary.
Chairman Ian Murray asked Mr.
David who has jurisdiction over the wetlands since there are some designated by
the Army Corps of Engineers and some by NYS DEC. He pointed out that there is some confusion between the SEQR
filing and the maps as to which wetlands are which.
Mr. David said that he would
find out what the designations are and make corrections.
It was clarified that HP
means “high point” on the maps. On
sheets L-1 and L-2, Lots 27 and 28 are reversed; the designation needs to be
corrected because Lot 27 has a proposed engineered septic system.
Chairman Ian Murray referred
to the water quality treatment on drawing L-2, Lot 14, and asked whether a
drywell should be installed. Mr. David
did not believe that was necessary. He
referred to the detail on drawing L-7, Lot 11.
Chairman Ian Murray said that
he was looking for additional trees for screening along the streets. He illustrated what he wanted on the
drawings; Mr. David said that the drawings would be revised.
Chairman Ian Murray referred
to drawing L-3, Lots 8 and 25, noting that the slopes are too great. He requested that the layout be flipped to
move the driveways, or to front-load the lots. A brief discussion followed on
the septic sites and lot layouts. Mr. David said that a grading plan for each
lot could be filed with its building permit application.
There followed a lengthy
discussion on use of the vertical curve at the driveway entrance. According to Mr. David, the road plans were
constrained by slopes, wetlands, and zoning regulations.
Finally, Chairman Ian Murray
advised Mr. David that he needs to provide a copy of the full long form EAF for
SEQR review. He also advised Mr. David
to provide neighbor notification so a second public hearing can be held at the
March Planning Board meeting. Chairman
Ian Murray stated for the record that the first public hearing on this
application was held on December 14, 2005.
Both Chairman Ian Murray and Ralph Pascucci noted that it was unlikely
that final approval would be possible before the April meeting at the earliest. Mr. David said that he is still waiting for
SHPPO approval of the archaeological study.
Patrick Hanehan asked about
the agricultural setbacks on the south and west side. Mr. David said that the buffer exceeds the required setbacks, but
would provide the exact numbers, which he believes to be 150’ and 100’,
respectively. There was a discussion
regarding the possibility of making these buffers a no-cut area.
Chairman Ian Murray asked the
Board if there were any further questions; there were none. RETURNING
Sketch-Plans
Arthur Kemmet, Applicant
183 River Road
Schuylerville, NY 12871
S/B/L 209.13-1-17 Conservancy
Gil Van Guilder appeared on
behalf of the returning Applicant, stating that the previous proposal for a
4-lot subdivision has now been reduced to a three lot subdivision on the
22.91+/- acre parcel situated primarily between NYS Rte 4 and River Road. Lot 1 is now 13 acres. The parcel straddles
NYS Route 4 and has additional frontage on Wilbur Road.
Mr. Van Guilder handed out a
revised map of the proposal, stating that the topography of the property is
primarily a ridge with wetlands on either side. There are both NYS DEC and Army Corps of Engineers designated
wetlands, and the appropriate setbacks have been incorporated into the
plans. Mr. Van Guilder said the
proposal complies with all FEMA regulations; 2-3’ of imported fill will be used
to raise each house to at or above the flood plain.
Chairman Ian Murray said that
he and Town Engineer Kenneth Martin had found information on FEMA maps to
establish the flood plain elevation at 97’, but that information is still not
provided on the proposal. Mr. Van
Guilder says that his office will provide an elevation certificate to FEMA for
flood insurance requirements at the time the Certificate of Occupancy is
issued. There will be grading plans for each individual lot. He added that he
has worked previously with Zoning Officer Robert Hathaway on homes along
Saratoga Lake that are situated in the flood plain. He added that the information will be included in the subdivision
plats if the Planning Board requires it.
A discussion followed on NYS
DOH requirements for septic systems in the flood plain. Chairman Ian Murray said that the current
septic plans are below the 100-year flood plain; he said that the 10-year flood
plain information is necessary to determine whether the property is even
buildable. Mr. Van Guilder said that he
would investigate this issue with FEMA and respond to the Board’s concerns.
A discussion followed on the
code requirements for building houses within the flood plain, such as not
having a basement, and having the electrical systems and first floor above the
flood plain. The discussion included a
history of flooding along NYS Route 4 and River Road which, according to Mr.
Kemmet’s recollection to Mr. Van Guilder, happened on a regular basis before
the dam was built on the Sacandaga River.
Chairman Ian Murray advised
Mr. Van Guilder to include the test pits and proposed septic sites on the
survey map. He also asked Mr. Van
Guilder to provide information on well and septic sites on the surrounding
properties to show that separation requirements have been met.
Chairman Ian Murray
recommended that the parking area near the river be eliminated to prevent it
from becoming a public parking area.
Town Engineer Kenneth Martin
asked for information on the septic expansion.
Mr. Van Guilder said that the
weather has prevented the Army Corps of Engineers from delineating the
wetlands. There was a discussion on the
possibility of isolated wetlands on the property, which needs to be verified.
Chairman Ian Murray asked the
Board if there were any further questions; there were none. RETURNING
David and Jane Sheeran, Applicants
176 Burke Rd
Saratoga Springs, NY
12866
S/B/L 181-1-26 Rural
Applicants are proposing to
subdivide a 34.39+/- acre parcel into four lots. An existing home (Lot #1) will
have a 4.69+/- acre lot. Lots 1, 3 and 4 will be 4.99+/- acres, 11.20+/- acres,
and 13.41+/- acres, respectively. Lot 3
would be a flag lot.
Dave Myers, of Myers
Engineering, appeared on behalf of the Applicants explaining that the existing
house sits on a bedrock ridge, and that the proposed lots were determined based
on function, septic sites, and aesthetics.
The parcel provides long range views off to the east. The septics on lots 1 and 4 will be
raised. Mr. Myers provided information
on the septic designs stating that material for the raised systems would be
imported since there is none available on the property.
The proposal would utilize
two existing driveways. The Sheerans
use one for their residence and would share that driveway with Lot 1. Lots 3 and 4 would share a driveway that is
currently a trail. Mr. Myers said the sight distance from the driveway is about
600’ from the north and about 500’ from the south. He noted that Burke Road is not posted for speed. He said that
the current driveway is quite steep and would not meet Town driveway
regulations. That issue would have to
be addressed.
Chairman Ian Murray noted for
the record that the flag lot was not included in the initial presentation to
the Board last month. He explained the
history of the zoning regulation regarding flag lots, stating that it was
intended to preserve the rural character of the Town, and gave an example of
where a flag lot was created behind working farmland in order to preserve the
road frontage and rural use of that land.
In this instance, the flag lot would be located behind an existing
house; therefore, there is no preservation of farmland. Instead, the use of the Sheerans’ proposed
flag lot would be purely for density. Both Chairman Ian Murray and Ralph
Pascucci stated their reluctance to set a precedent in this instance which
would open the door to similar proposals.
Ralph Pascucci said that there are several parcels situated within the
Town with the same constraints. He
added that the Board has consistently denied applications for flag lots when
they do not meet the zoning requirement.
Jane Sheeran explained to the
Board the rationale behind the lot layouts. There followed a lengthy discussion
on the process of the application before the ZBA and back again before the
Planning Board.
Laurie Griffen read from the
Town Zoning Regulations regarding flag lots:
M.1. Purpose
and Intent: The use of keyhole lots
is generally discouraged. The primary
objective is to prevent incremental development that
unnecessarily uses valuable
farmland and degrades the open space perspective of the
Town. Allowing limited
flag lots allows the Planning Board the flexibility to
negotiate the set-aside of roadside
views and agriculturally-used lands to get a better land
use pattern than would be
achieved by the straight road frontage rule.
M.4.d. In
situations where the above requirements cannot be met or where
environmental and scenic considerations are paramount,
the Planning Board can
permit access to a final one residence flag lot if deed
restrictions are imposed.
This standard prevents future incremental land
development of difficult properties.
Ralph Pascucci recommended
that the Applicants return to their initial proposal and request road frontage
variances from the Zoning Board of Appeals if necessary. Laurie Griffen stated that the Applicants
have other options that they could present to the Planning Board. Robert Park said that he does not want the
Planning Board to set a precedent of granting unnecessary flag lots.
Town Engineer Kenneth Martin
recommended that the Board do a site walk when weather permits. Mr. Myers
suggested that the application be tabled for now. TABLED
Darren Tracy, Applicant
235 Daniels Road
Saratoga Springs, NY
12866
S/B/L 157-1-21.11 Rural Residential
Terry Humistan appeared on
behalf of the Applicant, who proposes to divide his parcel on NYS Route 4 into
2 lots with existing buildings, with one lot to include the relocated house
from Schuylerville Central School. Mr.
Humistan provided a new copy of the survey, which relates to a proposed shared
driveway and includes the building envelope.
He then explained the history of the house, referred to as The Old
Webster House, which was previously owned by Schuylerville Central School and
was moved from one part of its property to a spot adjacent to Mr. Tracy’s
lands. The parcel with the house was
incorporated into Mr. Tracy’s land by lot-line adjustment granted by the
Planning Board in December 2006. The
closing on that transfer has taken place and Mr. Tracy is now applying for a
subdivision of the property with that residence in order to sell it.
Robert Park asked where the
existing septic is located; Mr. Tracy thought it might be behind the barns, but
was unsure because the installation predated his ownership of the property.
Chairman Ian Murray asked for
grading contours on the plan, a drainage plan, and sight distances for the
driveway.
Mr. Humistan said that the
school has fairly recently acquired a topographic map of all its property and
he was hopeful that he could obtain an overlay of that information for the
proposed subdivision. He said that the
septic system would need to be engineered, and perc tests will be conducted in
the spring of this year. There is an
existing gravel drive to the residence, previously owned by the school,
connected to the driveway used by the other buildings on his property; however,
Mr. Tracy explained that those buildings use the north end of the driveway,
which is the only end plowed in the winter.
Town Engineer Kenneth Martin
questioned whether NYS DOT has to approve a curb cut for the driveway. Mr. Humistan said that he would ask NYS DOT
to give an opinion on that and will put sight distances on the plans.
The Board determined that the
proposal meets road frontage and area requirements for the rural residential
district.
Due to the historic
sensitivity of the site, Chairman Ian Murray directed the Applicant to perform
an archaeological study in order to complete the SEQR review. Laurie Griffen asked if the school has
already performed a study on the property, and if it has, that information
could be used by the Applicant.
A discussion followed on when
the proposal will be eligible for a public hearing, which will probably be in
April. Town Engineer Kenneth Martin
stated that the short form EAF would be sufficient for SEQR review. RETURNING
Old Business: Chairman Ian Murray referred to the
statement read by Penelope Benson-Wright at the last meeting, noting that it
was a statement of opinion and not fact.
He wanted the Board members to know that they did a good job with the application,
which was highlighted and used as a positive example at the Association of
Towns Annual Training and Meeting held last month in New York City. He noted that the decision of the Board was
upheld in Court twice.
Laurie Griffen
asked the status of the following cases:
1.
Harold Reiser, III, who was referred to the Town Board for a
PUD in January in order to comply with zoning regulations. Mr. Reiser has not yet filed an application
with the Town Board.
2.
The Fish Creek Rod & Gun Club, which applied for a lot-line adjustment to
incorporate land from David and Betty Larmon.
Chairman Ian Murray said that the lands can be combined into one parcel
and the bank can use the building envelope for the club as collateral for the
bank loan.
3.
Louden Estates, which was granted final approval in December
2006. Chairman Ian Murray said that he
believed that Saratoga Builders planned to close on the property after the
first of the year. He had no further information.
4.
SBA Network Services, which has 2 pending cell tower applications
before the Board. Chairman Ian Murray
said the Applicant has been informed that the Town will not waive its
requirement that any application must include a copy of an FCC license. Ralph Pascucci noted that the Applicant can
meet this requirement simply by obtaining a letter of commitment from a
carrier; the carrier wouldn’t even have to be listed as a co-applicant.
Robert Park raised
the issue of the signage on the Giovanone boat storage facility. A lengthy discussion followed on the signage
around the Town. It was noted that ultimately
Zoning Officer Robert Hathaway approves signage.
Town Engineer
Kenneth Martin provided an update on the Gong property.
New Business: None
The next meeting
will be March 28, 2007.
A motion to adjourn was made at 10:00 p.m. by
Robert Park, and seconded by Laurie Griffen. Chairman Ian Murray – aye, Robert
Park – aye, Patrick Hanehan – aye, Ralph Pascucci – aye, Laurie Griffin – aye,
and Jennifer Koval – aye. Carried 6 – 0.
Respectfully
submitted,
Catherine
E. Cicero
Planning Clerk